S.H.A.P.E.
 
Main Menu
 Home
 About SHAPE/ Joining
 Forum
 Downloads
 Members
 Image Gallery
 S.H.A.P.E Store
 Other Websites
 Military Units
Welcome
Username:

Password:


Remember me

[ ]
[ ]
Online
Members: 0

Click To Show - Guests: 6

Last Seen

gpthelastrebel Fri 02:09
Patrick Fri 16:05
Robray Wed 14:28
D. L. Garland Wed 18:09
dong fang Mon 01:55
Forums
Moderators: gpthelastrebel, Patrick
Author Post
gpthelastrebel
Sat Jan 17 2009, 04:54PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Below is a letter that was forwarded to me describing the misuse of the Confederate Battleflag. Val and I managed to back track and find the person who originated the letter as Achim Bänsch (Commander SCV Europe Camp #1612 & Cpl. #542 SCV-MC 3rd Bn, Co D). I wrote Commander Bansch requesting information as to where to send the letters and he informed me this was an internal affair involving the SCV. I disagree I think misuse of the CBF involves all of us.

That being said I would like for someone to try and locate any news articles and contact information concerning the email posted below. SHAPE wants to go on record as protesting the dishonorable misuse of our flag even though we actually cannot do anything to stop it. As Val said to keep quite about this issue would be the same as supporting the actions and misuse of the CBF.

This project is open to all members. Feel to take part.

GP
*********************************************************************


SCV Chief of Heritage Defense


Frank Earnest


CC/ Brag Bowling, Commander ANV




MISUSE OF CONFEDERATE SYMBOLS IN EUROPE


SCV Europe Camp #1612




Commander




Sir,




I am writing directly to you because Europe Camp belongs to the Army of Northern Virginia but we have no Brigade or Division Heritage Chairman.




This is to report that things we never thought possible started to happen sporadically throughout Europe a few years ago and are quickly growing worse. The misuse of the Battle flag by certain racist groups during sport events has led to harsh reactions by the sport authorities of several European countries. In March 2006 the Polish Ice-Hockey Federation banned the Confederate battle flag in the Stadiums because of its “continuous use by racist groups”. The same year, the Austrian Soccer Federation drew a comparison line between Nazi flags and Confederate symbols, being used more and more often “as a substitute of the forbidden Nazi flag”. In November 2008 the Commissioner of Sport Events of Croatia (HNS), Josip Brezni, outlawed nationwide the use of Confederate symbols during soccer games due to their “association to Neo-Nazi groups”. In Spain we have recently detected a radical Soccer fan club which uses (misuses) the Confederate Navy Jack during the games and afterwards in violent actions in the streets. As a result, Spanish police now openly associates the Battle flag to violent gangs.




It seems there is an imminent ban of Confederate symbols in sport events at European Union level. This is supported by the World Soccer Association FIFA. The legal ban on the public display of Confederate flags in sport environments seems to be a good thing at first because it will put down the misuse in public. But there is the other side of the coin: newspapers and sport magazines usually write about these groups and publish photographs about incidents, often showing Nazi flags together with the battle flag. The result is a mental association in the reader’s minds putting together Neo-Nazi and Confederate symbols as being the same. This is especially dramatic due to the fact that Europeans have usually no idea of what Secession, the CSA and the WBTS were about. Our colors and our History will be polluted and final victory will be for the Heritage killers if we do not counteract. The misuse of our sacred banners by foreign people who don’t have the right even to touch them is deplored by CampEurope and we think it’s definitely time to act.




May I suggest the possibility that you write in your official capacity a press release with a short explanation about the historical background of our flags and how much we deplore and condemn their misuse by hate groups in Europe? We would then forward this communication throughout Europe to as many Sport Federations and Magazines as possible.




If you agree, we could forward it also to Sport Teams which have violent gangs among their followers. They should know that real Confederates have nothing in common with them and that their misuse of our banners is repugnant to us.




In addition, every SCV member, associate and friend in Europe writing an open letter in the press in the future, could refer to this official Heritage Defense communication to prove the misuse and abuse of Confederate symbols has nothing in common with true Confederates. Also, it could be used to counter certain journalists attacking the flag as a hate symbol.




Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Wed Jan 21 2009, 04:53PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Folks this is one of the sort things that SHAPE gets involved in. We cannot hope to change the attitude of people unless we address these issues. We cannot address these issues unless YOU help.

All this project requires is someone look on the computer and find contact info. Do we have anyone willing to step up to the task??

GP

[ Edited Wed Jan 21 2009, 04:55PM ]
Back to top
Anonymous
Wed Jan 21 2009, 05:41PM
Guest
George,

I just hurridedly checked back in after my email to you this morning. What contact information are you looking for? I'll check back in again by tonight and try to help.

Carolyn
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Thu Jan 22 2009, 03:17AM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Carolyn ,

I would like to find the sorce of these stories or incidents say Madrid, Barcelona or Paris and write a letter to these newspapers.

My time is going to be very limited, starting tomorrow, for the next few weeks since we are trying to finish our house repairs before money gets tight. I was hoping some of our new members would lend a hand. Still all in all, I should be able to get in about an hour or so a day.

GP
Back to top
Lady Val
Thu Jan 22 2009, 02:37PM
Registered Member #75
Joined: Sat Nov 01 2008, 03:22PM
Posts: 475
The quickest and best thing to do is draft a "generic" letter addressing the matter. Nothing long or complicated, just that we cannot prevent the misuse of our honored and revered symbols but that we want to go on record as stating that they are being dishonored and blasphemed and we strongly object. That states our case in a nutshell and if the contacts wish to print our response, they can do so without extensive editing.

Remember, we're not DEFENDING the flag; we don't have to and we should get over the general belief that it is necessary. We are COMPLAINING about its misuse. We have to redirect the focus of the outrage from (y)our flag to the hoodlums who are misusing it. Denounce the mobs, not the flag. After all, they could be carrying any flag and who could stop them.

When the letter is considered ready, then you simply address it to the various contacts and send it off under the signature of the person desired. Very simple and straightforward and once the letter is done, anybody can do the sending, so to speak.
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Thu Jan 22 2009, 04:22PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Exactly. To date the only info I have been able to find is these two links which were in the Demastus newsletter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9woGAarr_Ug&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qR61LTl1Aeo&feature=related

There is a section for comments but I fail to see how making a comment on U-Tube helps the situation at all. Do you agree?

GP
Back to top
Lady Val
Thu Jan 22 2009, 04:55PM
Registered Member #75
Joined: Sat Nov 01 2008, 03:22PM
Posts: 475
No. We need to forget the US and send our comments to the European news outlets. It is to Europe and its people that we need to get the word of our revulsion and rejection of these uses of (y)our flag. This has nothing to do with the US. In fact, we are doing this only to go "on record" in this matter rather than remain silent for, as you know, in the law, silence means assent. Once our stand has been publicly made, we have no choice but to let the matter play itself out over there - BUT WE MUST BE HEARD AND PUBLICLY or we run the risk of appearing to condone what is happening.
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Thu Jan 22 2009, 05:09PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
BTW I received another reply from SCV Europe, he still insists when he hears something from the SCV Heritage he will let me know.

GP
Back to top
Lady Val
Thu Jan 22 2009, 08:58PM
Registered Member #75
Joined: Sat Nov 01 2008, 03:22PM
Posts: 475
Get the European press contacts - Reuters, etc. - and send the letter. If the European SCV asks us to do anything further, we can consider their request. Still, I have to wonder why he wrote the damned letter in the first place if he had no plan to use the assistance he would be offered because of it. Makes no sense to me at all.
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Thu Jan 22 2009, 10:14PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Exactly. Unbeliveable.

GP
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Thu Jan 22 2009, 10:40PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Val,

Did about 20 minutes of searching today -- nothing-- except this http://www.namsouth.com/viewtopic.php?p=2400.

I'll look some more tomorrow after the contractors leave.

GP

GP
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Thu Jan 22 2009, 11:12PM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Gator, Randy,

Could one of you contact the SCV heritage committee and see what you can find out about this issue? I have looked until I am cross eyed and cannnot find anything. Let's see if we can put this thing to bed.

GP
Back to top
Lady Val
Fri Jan 23 2009, 01:31AM
Registered Member #75
Joined: Sat Nov 01 2008, 03:22PM
Posts: 475
Gentlemen, you are making a mountain out of a pimple. We don't have to know the particulars except that the battle flag has been banned in several European countries (Croatia is one, I know) because it is being used by neo-Nazi types. Don't bother to research the matter; it isn't important! All that is important is that we write a "generic letter" stating words to the effect that:

The Sons of Confederate Veterans and other defenders of Southern and Confederate heritage and history denounce, decry and repudiate any and all use of the symbols of the Confederacy by hoodlums, bigots, white supremacists and other anti-social persons and groups whatever their nationality or race.

Furthermore, we wish to point out that the Confederate States of America was no more "racist" than any other "Western" nation of the mid-19th century despite efforts to make it appear so by those engaged in the selective presentation of subjective "history". The men and women who lived and fought under that flag and who defended the nation it represented were honorable, noble, decent, courageous, loyal and, for the most part, Christian and therefore, the flag that they honored cannot be dishonorable - or dishonored.

In sum: those dishonorable persons and groups who sully the noble symbols of the Confederate States of America are hereby denounced and their principles and actions are rejected and repudiated by The Sons of Confederate Veterans and all other Southern and Confederate heritage organizations.

Something of this sort needs to be sent to all European press and media outlets, period. We don't have to contact the SCV in Europe or any particular country; the media is ubiquitous; it is everywhere and that's where our denouncement needs to go to be seen and recognized.
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Sat Jan 24 2009, 12:22AM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
But where would we send it, that is what I really need to know.

GP
Back to top
8milereb
Sat Jan 24 2009, 10:58PM

Registered Member #2
Joined: Thu Jul 19 2007, 03:39PM
Posts: 1030
George, honestly I do not know where we could send it to. Wonder if the Stars and Stripes(European Edition) would publish something? let me see what I can come up with. Val, you pretty much have the letter already written in your post, THANKS!
Back to top
gpthelastrebel
Sun Jan 25 2009, 03:04AM

Registered Member #1
Joined: Tue Jul 17 2007, 02:46PM
Posts: 4067
Works for me.

GP
Back to top
 

Jump:     Back to top

Syndicate this thread: rss 0.92 Syndicate this thread: rss 2.0 Syndicate this thread: RDF
Powered by e107 Forum System