Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Wed May 20 2009, 06:09PM
Ok folks, we know that the UDC will do nothing about this and the SCV is only going to produce a "statement" of concern to continue the practice as in years past....so what say you ????
notice that the letter is signed by Bill Ayers (radicial) & James McPherson ("civil war" historian)
George Mason University's History News Network http://hnn.us/articles/85884.html
5-19-09
Dear President Obama: Please Don't Honor the Arlington Confederate Monument
By Edward Sebesta and James Loewen
This letter was written by Edward Sebesta and James Loewen and signed by the scholars listed below.
May 18, 2009
President Barack H. Obama
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
Washington, DC 20500
Dear President Obama:
Since the administration of Woodrow Wilson, presidents have sent annually a wreath to the Arlington Confederate Monument. Prior to the administration of George H. W. Bush, this was done on or near the birthday of Jefferson Davis. Starting with George H.W. Bush, it has been done on Memorial Day.
We ask you to not send a wreath or some other commemorative token to the Arlington Confederate Monument during your administration or after.
There are several reasons as to why this monument, a product of the Nadir in American race relations, should not be honored, and we list and explain them in this letter.
The monument was intended to legitimize secession and the principles of the Confederacy and glorify the Confederacy. It isn’t just a remembrance of the dead. The speeches at its ground-breaking and dedication defended and held up as glorious the Confederacy and the ideas behind it and stated that the monument was to these ideals as well as the dead. It was also intended as a symbol of white nationalism, portrayed in opposition to the multiracial democracy of Reconstruction, and a celebration of the re-establishment of white supremacy in the former slave states by former Confederate soldiers. In its design it also tells wrong history, boasting fourteen shields with the coat of arms of fourteen states. Thus it claims that Missouri, Kentucky, and Maryland were part of the Confederacy. They weren’t.
The monument was given to the Federal Government by the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC), which raised the funds to erect it. The UDC’s reasons for the monument are instructive. In the address of Mrs. Daisy McLaurin Stevens, President General of the United Daughters of the Confederacy at its dedication, she makes clear that the monument is to glorify the ideas of the Confederacy:
Great ideas and righteous ideas are alone immortal. The eternal years of God are theirs. The ideas our heroes cherished were and are beneficial as they are everlasting. These were living then; they are living to-day and shall live to-morrow and work the betterment of mankind. Thus our heroes are of those who, though dead, still toil for man through the arms and brains of those their examples have inspired and quickened to nobler things.
Since the United Daughters of the Confederacy upheld in multiple publications in the early 20th Century that the Ku Klux Klan was the heroic effort of the Confederate soldier, we have an idea what the “noble past” and “ideas our heroes cherished” were. Of course one of these “ideas” was secession to preserve the institution of African slavery.
Likewise General Bennett H. Young, Commander-in-Chief of the United Confederate Veterans also defends the cause of the Confederate soldier, the neo-Confederate cause of their descendants, and defends secession in his speech as follows:
At this hour I represent the survivors of the Southern army. Though this Confederate monument is erected on Federal ground, which makes it unusual and remarkable, yet the men from whom I hold commission would only have me come without apologies or regrets from the past. Those for whom I speak gave the best they had to their land and country. They spared no sacrifice and no privation to win for the Southland national independence.
I am sure I shall not offend the proprieties of either the hour of the occasion when I say that we still glory in the records of our beloved and immortal dead. The dead for whom this monument stands sponsor died for what they believed to be right. Their surviving comrades and their children still believe that that for which they suffered and laid down their lives was just; that their premises in the Civil War were according to our Constitution….
The sword said the South was wrong, but the sword is not necessarily guided by conscience or reason. The power of numbers and the longest guns cannot destroy principle nor obliterate truth. Right lives forever, it survives battles, failures, conflicts, and death. There is no human power, however mighty, that can in the end annihilate truth.
In fact, most white Southerners in 1914 agreed that both slavery and secession were wrong. Not Young. No apologies. No regrets -- despite the historical record of Confederate soldiers having committed racial atrocities of massacring surrendered African American soldiers on at least eight occasions.
Hilary A. Herbert, Chairman of the Executive Committee of the Arlington Confederate Monument Association, makes it clear that the monument stands for the legitimacy of secession, in opposition to Reconstruction, and for white supremacy. In his History of The Arlington Confederate Monument at Arlington, Virginia, he writes:
In 1867 the seceding States were subjected to the horrors of Congressional Reconstruction, but in a few years American manhood had triumphed; Anglo-Saxon civilization had been saved; local self-government under the Constitution had been restored; ex-Confederates were serving the National Government, and true patriots, North and South, were addressing themselves to the noble task of restoring fraternal feeling between the sections.
Within a generation after Congressional Reconstruction, American historians condemned it …. as “a crime against civilization,” and public opinion seems to have approved the verdict.
Herbert goes on to refer to the Confederate soldiers who joined the Ku Klux Klan and Red Shirts as being heroes for restoring white supremacy and overthrowing Reconstruction, referring to “the soldiers who fought the battles of the Confederacy and … by their courage and devotion during the two decades after the war, were saviors of Anglo-Saxon civilization in their section.”
The monument itself has a Latin motto, “Victrix causea Diis placuit, sed victa Catoni.” It translates, “The winning cause pleased the Gods, but the losing cause pleased Cato.” This is a classical reference which to the cognoscenti implies that Lincoln was a despot and the Union cause unjust; Cato, the stoic believer in “freedom,” would have sided with the Confederacy.
The Arlington Confederate Monument is a denial of the wrong committed against African Americans by slave owners, Confederates, and neo-Confederates, through the monument’s denial of slavery as the cause of secession and its holding up of Confederates as heroes. This implies that the humanity of Africans and African Americans is of no significance.
Today, the monument gives encouragement to the modern neo-Confederate movement and provides a rallying point for them. The modern neo-Confederate movement interprets it as vindicating the Confederacy and the principles and ideas of the Confederacy and their neo-Confederate ideas. The presidential wreath enhances the prestige of these neo-Confederate events.
Fr. Alister C. Anderson, as Chaplain-in-Chief of the Sons of Confederate Veterans (SCV), at the 85th anniversary of the dedication of the Arlington Confederate Monument in 1999, gave a lengthy speech explaining its meaning. His understanding of the Arlington Confederate Monument can be said to be fairly representative of modern neo-Confederate opinion.
Anderson believes that the Civil War was a holy war between an orthodox Christian nation (the South), a view widespread in the neo-Confederate movement, and what he feels was an un-Christian and heretical North, as he explained in a series of articles in the Confederate Veteran as Chaplain-in-Chief of the SCV. This explains some of the passages of his speech at the Arlington Confederate Monument. In his speech Anderson explains regarding the monument:
… It reveals and concentrates in beautiful, rugged bronze nearly every idea that a true Southern historian, theologian, statesman, and patriotic citizen could present about the religion, culture, morals, economics, and politics of a civilization from out of which the Confederate States of America evolved. The monument captures the ideals and accomplishments that still existed at the end of the War for Southern Independence. Thank God it does not depict the beginning of the Reconstruction Era, the most disgusting and destructive period in United States history from which the South has never really recovered.
Anderson goes on to note Washington’s presence in bronze:
It depicts George Washington on horseback with the Latin inscription DEO VINDICE, which means, “God Vindicates.” Southerners believed under the Constitution they had the right to secede if they were being harmed by a tyrannical government.
To Anderson, as to other neo-Confederates today, the Arlington Monument exists to glorify the ideas of the Confederacy, which he sees as the ideas of the neo-Confederacy.
Anderson goes on to explain, correctly, the meaning of the main inscription on the monument, “Victrix causea Diis placuit, sed victa Catoni.” This is a line from a poem Pharasalia by the Roman poet Lucan, used to represent Lincoln as a tyrant and the North as tyrannical. Fr. Anderson explains:
Victix causa, “the winning cause (or side)”, referring to Julius Caesar’s inordinate ambition and his lust for total power and control, is compared with President Lincoln and the Federal Government’s desire and power to crush and destroy the South. Next we read diis placuit which translates “pleased the gods.” In this context, gods are with a small “g” and refer to the gods of mythology; the gods of money, power, war and domination, greed, hate, lust and ambition. Next we come to the noble climax of this quotation, sed victa cantoni which translates “but the losing side (or cause) pleased Cato”. Here Lucan, the poet, refers to Pompey’s fight to retain the old conservative, traditional republican government of Rome. Even though Pompey was defeated by Caesar’s greater military power, his defeat, nevertheless, pleased the noble Cato. And here, of course, Cato represents the noble aims of the Southern Confederacy. The South fought politically to maintain the Constitution which had guided her safely for eighty-seven years. She merely wanted to be left alone and governed by it. The aggression-minded totalitarian Northern government would not permit that and so she pleased the gods of abolitionism, transcendentalism, utopianism, state centralism, universalism, rationalism and a host of other “isms.”
Anderson here denounces abolition, the anti-slavery movement that ultimately led the United States of America out of the moral evil of slavery, as an evil itself.
Sending a wreath to the Arlington Confederate Memorial Monument enhances the prestige of the United Daughters of the Confederacy, an organization with a long history of racism from praising the Ku Klux Klan in the early part of the 20th century, to publishing articles against the Civil Rights movement in the Civil Rights Era, to promoting neo-Confederacy today. When the president of the United States of America enhances the prestige of this monument and of the United Daughters of the Confederacy, he strengthens a group working to set back America’s progress in race relations.
Finally, in 2009, the main speaker for the annual observance at the Arlington Confederate Memorial is Ron Maxwell, director of the movie “Gods and Generals,” whose neo-Confederate meaning he made clear in an interview in Southern Partisan. He also has written expressing his fear of Hispanic immigration leading to civil war in the notoriously racist Chronicles magazine, the organ of the ultra-right Rockford Foundation.
For the president of the United States of America to send a wreath to the monument this year would contribute to providing Ron Maxwell with a more prestigious setting for his speech. It would aid and abet the ongoing use of presidential prestige and this monument for their neo-Confederate agenda.
We ask you to break this chain of racism stretching back to Woodrow Wilson, and not send a wreath or other token of esteem to the Arlington Confederate Monument. This monument should not be elevated in prestige above other monuments by a presidential wreath.
Sincerely yours,
Last Name First Name Institution Biographical Information (for identification purposes only)
Alexander Shawn Leigh Langston Hughes Center, Kansas University Assistant Professor African and African American Studies, Interim Director, Langston Hughes Center
Attie Jeanie Long Island University Associate Professor of History
Ayers Bill University of Illinois, Chicago Professor of Education
Barber David University of Tennessee, Martin Assistant Professor of History
Blakely Allison Boston University Professor of European and Comparative History; George and Joyce Wein Professor of African American Studies.
Bridges Roger D. Rutherford .B. Hayes Presidential Center Executive Director Emeritus
Brown Joshua The City University of New York Executive Director American Social History Project/ Center for Media and Learning, Professor of History, Ph.D. Program in History, The Graduate Center.
Burton Orville Vernon Coastal Carolina University Burroughs Distinguished Professor of Southern History and Culture at Coastal Carolina University. Formerly he was Director of the Institute for Computing in the Humanities, Arts, and Social Sciences (ICHASS) at the University of Illinois, where he is Professor of History, African American Studies, and Sociology. He is also a Senior Research Scientist at the National Center for Supercomputing Applications (NCSA), where he is Associate Director of Humanities and Social Sciences. In addition, he is Executive Director of the College of Charleston’s Program in the Carolina Lowcountry and Atlantic World.
Christie Thomas Lincoln Public Schools, Lincoln, Nebraska Multicultural Administrator
Davis Simone Mt. Holyoke College Professor of English
Ewert George Former Director of the Museum of Mobile
Farley Jonathan Institute fur Algebra Johannes Kepler Universitat Linz Teaching and Research Fellow
Fellman Gordon Brandeis University Professor of Sociology
Fink Leon University of Illinois, Chicago Distinguished Professor. Director of WRGUW (Graduate Concentration in the History of Work, Race, and Gender in the Urban World)
Department of History
Finkelman Paul Albany Law School President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
Gundaker Grey College of William & Mary Professor of Anthropology
Hague Euan DePaul University, Chicago Professor of Cultural Geography, editor of "Neo-Confederacy: A Critical Introduction."
Hayes-Bautista David E School of Medicine, UCLA Author of numerous articles on Calfornia Hispanic history
Hicks David Virginia Tech Associate Professor of History and Social Science Education
Jackson Kenneth T. Columbia University, NYC Professor of History and Social Sciences
Jennings Matt H. Macon State College Student
Katznelson Ira Columbia University, NYC Ruggles Professor of Political Science and History
Kennedy Roger G. National Museum of American History (ret.), National Park Service (ret.) Director Emeritus, National Museum of American History, Former Director, National Park Service
Key Barclay Western Illinois University Assistant Professor of African-American History
Key DeWayne Mars Hill Bible School, Florence, Alabama
Knapp Peter Villanova University Professor of Sociology
Leib Jonathan Old Dominion University Associate Professor of Geography
Loewen James Univ. of Vermont Professor Emeritus of Sociology, Univ. of Vermont; author of "Lies My Teacher Told Me," "Lies Across America," "Sundown Towns," etc.
Love David, A. Commentator Columnist at www.blackcommentator.com
McPherson James Princeton University Professor of History
Miller Willaim Lee Univ. of Virginia
Mitchell Don Syracuse University Professor of Geography
Mizell Linda University of Colorado at Boulder Assistant Professor, School of Education
Murray Paul Siena College Professor of Sociology
Nieto Sonia University of Massachusetts at Amherst Professor Emerita, Language, Literary, and Culture
Owens Deirdre Cooper University of Mississippi Assistant Professor of History
Parenti Michael On advisory boards of Independent Progressive Politics Network, Education Without Borders, the Jasenovic Foundation, New Political Science, and Nature, Society and Thought. Author of many books in political science.
Phillips Michael Collin College, Plano, Texas History Professor, Author of "White Metropolis"
Roisman Florence W. Indiana University School of Law William F. Harvey Professor of Law
Schmeeckle Maria Illinois State University Associate Professor of Sociology
Sebesta Edward H. Independent researcher. Editor of "Neo-Confederacy: A Critical Introduction," University of Texas Press.
Shabazz Amilcar University of Massachusetts at Amherst Professor and Chair of the W.E.B. DuBois Department of Afro-American Studies
Sinha Manisha University of Massachusetts at Amherst Associate Professor of Afro-American Studies and History
Sleeter Christine California State University Monterey Bay Professor Emerita, College of Professional Studies
Sowa Maureen Bristol Community College Professor of History
Webster Gerald Raymond University of Wyoming Chair, Department of Geography
White George, Jr. York College, CUNY Assistant Professor of History
Wiener Jon University of California, Irvine; The Nation Magazine Contributing Editor at "The Nation"; Professor of History at UC-Irvine.
*******************************************************************************
Note I posted, at the top, link to George Mason University's History News Network.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Wed May 20 2009, 07:30PM
Frankly, I agree wholeheartedly with the signatories and, in fact, I hope that they also do not honor your noble dead.
The dishonorable, corrupt, malignant, tyrannous and wicked cannot “honor” anything – and this whole group starting with the Fraud-in-Chief and including the signatory “scholars” – are incapable of bestowing honor or grace or decency or any other noble attribute. Frankly, I would sooner that a decent drunk urinated on my grave than that any one of these creatures paid it homage.
In fact, if I were the SCV and the UDC and the LoS, I’d have a cordon of good Southrons surrounding the monument to make absolutely sure that no politician of any stripe, pseudo-historian or academician went anywhere near it! Remember, it is as praiseworthy to be despised by the despicable as it is to be admired by the admirable. I hope your noble dead are spared the attentions of the present government and creatures like those who signed this "letter". Let them go honor Lincoln, a man who deserves the praise of the hypocrites, grafters and murderers.
Further, I call for a groundswell of letters by Southerners - and especially those in leadership roles in the movement - to newspapers, magazines, television and radio stations, internet blogs et al. demanding that this request be honored to the point at which no individual who has any connection ideologically, politically or morally with the current illegal occupant of the White House is permitted within 100 feet of any Confederate monument or the graves of its noble dead! Bet that would get a whole lot of notice in the media!
Ask yourself, gentlemen and ladies, would Lee or Jackson or Stuart or my Mosby be happy to see old Obammy comin' up the hill with his coterie of hangers-on to get his "photo-op" at their graves? I think we all know the answer to that question!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Wed May 20 2009, 11:22PM
Val,
Write (edit) the above into a letter and I will get some signatures on it ASAP. It is too late to send to Obama, but I think we still have time to get our point across. The only restriction I know about SHAPE and politics is that we are not supposed to try to Federal influence legislation AFTER we are granted our 501C status.
Once it is done I am going to send a copy to Owens Deirdre Cooper University of Mississippi Assistant Professor of History.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gator, Thu May 21 2009, 02:10AM
can i get a copy of the letter so that i can pass it to some louisiana officals
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 03:13AM
I am thinking that we can just use the edit button and add our names to the letter. If you get time try it with this post. I am an admin so I know I can do it. Not sure about nonmembers. I am gonna sign off and give it a try as a non member,
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 03:16AM
A non member cannot add his name to the list they can only use the quote feature.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Thu May 21 2009, 02:43PM
Here is a draft of a possible letter. If it is not suitable, let me know where the problems lie and I'll try to "tweak it up".
-----------------------------------
The “scholars” who have petitioned President Obama to ignore the Confederate monument in Arlington on Memorial day are absolutely correct. Indeed, it is to be devoutly hoped that Obama, representatives of the present “government” and the likes of these bastions of failed academia avoid all contact with and desecration of the monuments and graves of the noble Confederate dead together with any hypocritical acts of pretended homage.
The dishonorable, corrupt, tyrannous and wicked cannot “honor” anything; it is a contradiction in terms. This whole cabal - beginning with a man whose constitutional legitimacy to hold the office of President is highly questionable and including the signatory “scholars” - are incapable of bestowing any noble attribute, much less one worthy of the men honored by this monument.
Indeed, those organizations and individuals who value and honor Southern history and heritage should provide a cordon of good Southrons around the monument to make absolutely sure that no politician of any stripe, no pseudo-historian or self-acclaimed academician goes anywhere near it! Remember, it is as praiseworthy to be despised by the despicable as it is to be admired by the admirable. Let us hope that the South’s noble dead are spared the attentions of the present government and the "signatory scholars". Let them go and honor Lincoln, an earlier corrupt product of the infamous Illinois political machine and a man who deserves the praise of hypocrites, grafters and murderers.
We must ask if Robert E. Lee would rejoice at the current occupant of the White House with his coterie of knaves and sycophants using his grave for crass propaganda? All those who fought and died during the War of Secession spilled their blood to oppose the tyrants in Washington. Will we beg the current tyrant to use Confederate heroes as a tawdry “photo-op” in hopes that he will bestow upon us the lesser descendants of greater ancestors, legitimacy and relevance in the coming New World Order? God forbid!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 04:06PM
I like it!!! Gonna ask Pat for some assistance on this.
Note I added the SHAPE logo to it.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Thu May 21 2009, 05:46PM
I am glad it is to your liking. But please do not feel it necessary to give any mention of myself in its formation. I did it for you as Southerners. I certainly do not mind being associated with it as I have already posted similar statements on the web, but my involvement might tend to "muddy the waters" if it is seen to be a "Yankee" effort to put words in the mouths of Southrons.
Of course, when you send it to various persons or groups, you can certainly mention its origins since I am very much against folks who haven't the courage to sign their names to their opinions, but I have no desire for acclaim public or otherwise though I do not fear criticism or worse - getting used to it, you know!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 07:15PM
Yankee or not I tend to agree Obama has not earned the right to have anything to do with honoring my ancestors. He is against everything they fought for. Also you are a member of SHAPE in good standing and that is good enough with us.
We are working on getting it posted as a petition, although it will not be a petition in a true sense it will just be a letter which people sign, I intend to print it up and send to some of those biased, liberal scholars.
It will be good to feed them some of their own medicine.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 21 2009, 08:20PM
George we do not have our Federal 501(c) status yet do we? if not then let's push this to the max. I think the letter is good to go. I just sent it to my 2 Senators and Congressman with my own letter attached( highlighting Bill Ayers endorsement) They are most likely unaware of this, and honestly I cannot find anything out there that would suggest this letter was received/acknowledged/endorsed by the President and his office plans to NOT go through with the wreath laying ceremony. Anybody out there got any other news on this?
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 09:45PM
Not at this time and our only restriction as a 501 group is that we not try to influnece legislation. If we could find the email address for the site Obama put up----
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 09:54PM
Mark, Val, should we add Sir or Madam or another greeting to the top ? How about we we the undersigned ---
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 21 2009, 10:31PM
Both in my opinion, also need a lead in/ preface or something, like: After reading the letter sent to Mr. Obama by this so called esteemed group of intellects and historians including the self admitted terrorist Bill Ayers we offer this as our response........
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 11:19PM
heck ya'll get the finer details fixed and i'll get to work tomorrow. Pat can post as soon as he gets the OK.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 22 2009, 12:36AM
I love the idea of an outright REJECTION of the whole rotten crew. They believe that we'll be crying in our beer at being spurned by such important people. Dolts! Who cares what they think (IF they think, most of them!) In fact, if any one of them had something good to say about me, I'd dress in sackcloth and throw ashes on my head for whatever terrible sin I committed that gained their approval!
It's time we stopped trying to be loved. I really do "dig" that saying about being despised by the despicable... it fits the bill here right enough.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Patrick, Fri May 22 2009, 04:01AM
Here is the petition on the SHAPE website that people can sign. Please let me know if I need to change anything.
SHAPE Petition
You can also get to the petition from the main menu. It is the last item on the main menu.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Fri May 22 2009, 04:55AM
Thanks Pat can you note somewhere or perhaps even paste on the petition the letter Mr. J. W. Booth posted. That way everyone will know what they are signing.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 22 2009, 01:14PM
Signed and left comment (naturally). I'll post its site where I can.
Have contacted a lot of folks and asked them to contact others. I know that some have signed on already. Hopefully, the thing will "mushroom" as it becomes known, but we have to "beat the drums" for it until it gathers its own momentum.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Fri May 22 2009, 05:20PM
Just sent out a mass mail to all my contacts, in addition to emailing all SHAPE Members from our GMAIL.. Thank you Lady Val for all your efforts!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 22 2009, 07:54PM
You're entirely welcome. Only wish I could do more.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Mon May 25 2009, 12:24AM
To fully understand just "who" Ed Sebesta is & what he is, please click on........
http://web.archive.org/web/20021222000259/www.orderofwhitetrash.com/cfish/index2.htm
We tread on very thin-ice when we declare that we "agree" with ANYTHING that this homosexual hater of everything Southron writes. At last check, Ed is still living with his black gay lover.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Mon May 25 2009, 12:55AM
Mr. Booth,
Thanks for the link it will come in handy later.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 28 2009, 05:07PM
That was me btw, I was having fits trying to sign in, gave up and went with Anonymous...LOL
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 28 2009, 05:13PM
Mr Booth, I just read over some of the info on the link you provided, I agree this man is slime squared!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Thu May 28 2009, 09:37PM
8milereb,
to be polite here let me just say that I have been fighting the "crawfish" for over 14 years, over Southern Heritage issues. He works very closely with Kyle Vanlandingham (who is also gay) & Morris Dees, Mark Potok & Heidi Berich of the SPLC.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 29 2009, 10:58AM
I will make no comment upon this as I have no right to do so. I will leave it up to those who do have a right to respond.
Wreaths win Obama praise from Sons of Confederate Veterans
Gestures honor black Union soldiers as well as Confederate war dead
By WAYNE WASHINGTON - wwashington©thestate.com
President Barack Obama, the nation’s first black chief executive, will be getting a thank you note from the Sons of Confederate Veterans for continuing a tradition of honoring the Confederate dead on Memorial Day.
A group of 48 historians, including one from Coastal Carolina University, had asked Obama not to send a wreath to an Arlington National Cemetery monument honoring Confederate dead — a practice started in 1914 by Woodrow Wilson, who was born in Virginia and lived in Columbia as a young man.
Obama sent the wreath to the Confederate monument, but he also sent one to a Washington, D.C., cemetery that honors black Union soldiers.
The president’s actions pleased Chuck McMichael, commander in chief of the Sons of Confederate Veterans.
“The president did very well by sending a wreath to honor American veterans of all types,” McMichael said. “He upheld the tradition of the office to which he was elected. I do intend to send him a thank you letter. This is the kind of thing that transcends politics.”
Orville Vernon Burton, who teaches Southern culture and history at Coastal Carolina, was among the 48 historians who signed the letter asking Obama not to send a wreath to the Confederate monument.
Burton said there is not enough appreciation for the many Southerners — black and white — who fought to keep the Union together.
On Memorial Day, presidents typically lay a wreath at Arlington’s Tomb of the Unknowns, a monument to U.S. service members who have died without being identified.
Presidents also have directed that a wreath be sent to the Confederate monument.
Burton said he was concerned that Obama would be “singling out a group that wanted to split the Union” unless he also sent a wreath to a Union monument.
“People don’t know how close we came to not having a Union, and what that would mean for freedom today,” he said.
Burton said he learned about the historians’ letter through one of its two authors, James Loewen. A sociologist, author and professor, Loewen also has argued the statue of former S.C. politician “Pitchfork” Ben Tillman on the State House grounds should be toppled because of Tillman’s career-long support of white supremacy and violent black disenfranchisement.
Officials at the White House did not respond Tuesday or Wednesday to questions about Obama’s decision to send a wreath to the Confederate monument.
McMichael of the Sons of Confederate Veterans said he was glad the president did not address the letter. “I thought the letter was absurd and should not have been taken seriously.”
Burton said he does not know of any official response to the historians’ letter, which detailed the Confederate monument’s history, its Latin inscriptions and the words of those who have spoken in its shadow.
“The monument was intended to legitimize secession and the principles of the Confederacy,” the letter states. “It isn’t just a remembrance of the dead.”
In not responding to the letter, Obama steered clear of the passions that still exist regarding slavery and the Civil War.
Alexander Stephens, vice president of the Confederate States of America, said in 1861 that “African slavery” was “the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution,” a verdict many present-day historians accept.
But the Web site for the Sons of Confederate Veterans, which describes itself as “the oldest hereditary organization for male descendants of Confederate soldiers,” says the “citizen-soldiers who fought for the Confederacy personified the best qualities of America. The preservation of liberty and freedom was the motivating factor in the South’s decision to fight the Second American Revolution.”
Burton said Obama’s decision also to send a wreath to a cemetery honoring black Union soldiers was “extremely diplomatic.”
Not sending a wreath to the Confederate monument “would have been harder for him because he’s African-American,” said Burton, adding Obama would have encountered a backlash from some white Americans.
In the end, Burton said, he can accept Obama’s decision to send a wreath to both Union and Confederate monuments.
“It does represent the reconciliation of North and South,” he said.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 29 2009, 11:13AM
RE the Sebasta material: one of the documents listed no longer seems to be available. Sebasta is only a symptom of a much larger problem and the fact that his particular "hobby horse" has garnered the approval of men who are considered "historians" like McPherson clearly shows that these decisions are being made on matters not concerned with history but with ideology. Well, if that is the case (and it is), we'd better be prepared to defend not only your history, but our ideology or the facts simply won't matter at all.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Fri May 29 2009, 12:08PM
I notice he placed a wreath for the USCT. I find it a bit amusing that they were segregated in the WBTS and are still segregated today. I think it is great we have a Confederate Monument to honor all races that fought for the Confederacy.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Fri May 29 2009, 03:13PM
I have often wondered if the Union chose to raise USCT's as a means to end the war, or THEM!..they were often used as cannon fodder
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Fri May 29 2009, 03:28PM
I'll admit I haven't researched this a lot, but from what I have read, the USCT mostly freed more whites to die. I did some research sometime back and the best figures I could find was a high of 3,500 USCT dieing in battle.
GP
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Fri May 29 2009, 06:07PM
Good point George, just look at the Battle of the crater. With the tunnel approaching success, preparation began above ground for a possible assault. Burnside selected his largest and freshest division, his Fourth Division for the attack. His other three divisions had been in combat since the Wilderness, and were in no fit state to launch another attack. The only problem was that this division contained mostly black troops. In something of a catch-twenty two situation, the Fourth Division had been denied combat because it had no combat experience. Now they were to get their great chance. They were as keen as any unit in the Union army, determined to prove their fighting ability.
Right at the last minute they were denied that chance. Despite eleven days of intense training, on 29 July General Meade decided to withdraw them from the operation. There appears to have been a combination of reasons for this. First was the concern about using an inexperienced division, especially on such a complex operation. Second was a general worry about the consequences of using a black division in such an attack. If things went wrong, Grant and Meade could have been accused of using their black soldiers in an unjustifiably risky attack. The Fourth Division had been trained to take advantage, advancing rapidly, avoiding entering the crater itself, securing the flanks of the breach in the lines and hopefully preventing the Confederates from forming a new line further back. Ledlie’s men knew none of this. They advanced slowly towards the scene of devastation. Many went straight down into the crater, instead of splitting left and right around it.
All of this gave the Confederate artillery time to target the crater, slowing down the Union advance even more. Meanwhile, Confederate troops who had fled the area, fearing a second explosion, began to return. A counterattack, organised by William Mahone, soon forced the confused Union attacks back out of the crater, with heavy losses. The Fourth Division managed to get into the battle just in time to take many of these losses.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Fri May 29 2009, 06:47PM
On July 30, Union military engineers exploded a vast amount of dynamite in a shaft that had been dug under Confederate lines. Five regiments of Colored Troops had been assigned the task of spearheading the resultant Union attack into the gaping hole in the Rebel lines. The 28th USCT was one of the regiments selected. The black troops from the divisions of Generals Ledlie and Ferrero stormed into the massive crater caused by the explosion amid a maze of broken bodies and bloody rivulets. While the black troops gathered in awe at the base of the crater, their generals remained behind, drinking liquor in a dug out bomb proof hut. Without effective leadership, the impetus and surprise of the attack died out and gave Rebel forces under General William Mahone time to counterattack. The Rebel counter stroke was brutal in force and ferocity. Black soldiers in the crater tried to surrender, but Mahone’s men refused the surrender and shot down and bayoneted the leaderless Union troops. The attack that had been so promising now devolved into a foot race back to the safety of the Union siege lines. Behind them, the 28th USCT left nearly half of their brothers dead or wounded, including seven of eleven officers.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 29 2009, 06:48PM
It wasn't Meade, it was Grant. Burnside did his homework and had a great plan in motion but Grant wouldn't permit the black troops to lead. One Yankee who presented it said he was afraid of negative publicity if the death toll was too high (try making that point about the black troops wiped out attacking Fort Wagner). Another more cynical fellow said that Grant didn't want the blacks to get the credit of the victory and so Burnside had no choice but to send in white troops who had not been prepared. They marched into instead of around the pit and were shot like ducks in a barrel. By the time the black troops were allowed to assist, Mahone had arrived with his cavalry and the end result was not pretty.
One fellow Confederate reported that a lot of the casualties suffered by the black troops resulted from cries as they attacked that they were fighting "under the black flag" and would kill every white including civilians. Now I've heard that before, but whether it is an accurate report or simply something that is an "urban legend", I don't know.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Sat May 30 2009, 04:34AM
Regardless of the losses at the crater or anyplace else, the total number lost is battle wouldn't scratch the surface of what the white troops for either side lost. That is the point I am making in reference to the 8 massacres mentioned in the letter. I just do not see it. Hopefully by the end of next week I will get started on some letter writing.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Sat May 30 2009, 10:50AM
Well, one thing that I have heard and is supposedly well substantiated. Black Confederate prisoners of war were often shot when they reached the prison camps to which they were sent. Hardly an "enlightened" act on the part of the noble Union.
Also, with regard to Union "buffalo soldiers" as the Indians called them, well when they died at the hands of Confederates it is presented as if they were singled out rather than just being another casualty of war. Black federals however, were often used to guard Confederate prisoners and took an especial delight in tormenting them, especially the officers. One former slave found himself guarding his former master and took delight in tormenting him by shouting "Top rung on de bottom now, Massa! Top rung on de bottom!" It is not unusual therefore, that the reaction of many Southern soldiers towards black Yankees was more than ordinarily hostile.
Still, I am reminded of what an Indian chief told members of Congress when he testified about the war in the west: "When the white man wins, it is a victory. When the Indian wins, it is a massacre." The same can be said for black Union casualties.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Sat May 30 2009, 02:57PM
"Black Confederate prisoners of war were often shot when they reached the prison camps to which they were sent."
I have also heard that. I would love to have some instances of this with solid sources.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Sat May 30 2009, 03:25PM
During the day the platform around the pen is constantly paced by sentinels chiefly of the Invalid Corps, whose duty it is to see that the prisoners are orderly, and particularly, that no one crosses “the dead line.” This is a shallow ditch traced around within the enclosure, about fifteen feet from the fence. The penalty for stepping over this is death and although the sentinels are probably instructed to warn any one who may be violating the rule, the order does not seem to be imperative, and the negroes, when on duty, rarely troubled themselves with this superfluous formality.
Last night the negro regiment which constitutes part of our guard and which had been raiding over in Westmoreland and the adjacent counties returned. Their captives consisted of a hundred head of cattle-principally poor women’s cows-several ploughs, buggies, primeval sulkies, harrows, beds, chairs, etc and who knows what else they may do and all from twenty to thirty decrepit CITIZENS. Every month and sometimes more frequently, they are sent across the river by their officers on a plundering tour. These raids, usually made in a country entirely devoid of Confederates soldiers, are not reported by the yankees but are used to keep alive the martial ardor and fidelity of the black troops.
...Sgt. Anthony M. Keiley, POW, Pt. Lookout
Sorry I know I got off topic, but as you can see in this letter there were bad things going on that many folks have never heard of.
Over 180,000 African Americans fought in this war, on both sides of the battle. The total number of African American soldiers who died during the Civil War was around 40,000.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Sat May 30 2009, 03:43PM
Letter of Private Frank Bailey, 34th New York Infantry Regiment USA to his brother in Middleville, New York: -
"West Point, Virginia, 12 May 1862 - I hear that the Rebels sent out a Regt. of niggers to fight our men and that they were as naked as when they were born, except the brogues on their feet, and they incited to all sorts of cruelty. It is said that they cut the throats of our wounded and then rob them of every article of any value. The soldiers are death on niggers now. If they catch a [censored] in the woods, and there is no officer near, they hang them without any ceremony. Now if this is true that the Southern chivalry as they style themselves put these niggers up to such deeds as this, may the curse of good light on them. It is worse than the English were in the Revolution to hire the Indians, but their race is about run when the stoop to such barbarism as that. Yesterday there was two niggers hung close by here by our men. One of them had $20.00 government note in his pocket. There is no mistake but the Rebels have black soldiers for I have seen them brought in as prisoners of war. I hear most are killed even before they reach the prison which serves them right.I saw one who had the stripes of an orderly sergeant on his coat. I don't beleive in taking them prisoner, but kill them where ever they find them, that they may never more curse the land with their hateful presence."
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Sat May 30 2009, 05:06PM
That it. Great job!!!!!!
GP
, Wed May 20 2009, 06:09PM
Ok folks, we know that the UDC will do nothing about this and the SCV is only going to produce a "statement" of concern to continue the practice as in years past....so what say you ????
notice that the letter is signed by Bill Ayers (radicial) & James McPherson ("civil war" historian)
George Mason University's History News Network http://hnn.us/articles/85884.html
5-19-09
Dear President Obama: Please Don't Honor the Arlington Confederate Monument
By Edward Sebesta and James Loewen
This letter was written by Edward Sebesta and James Loewen and signed by the scholars listed below.
May 18, 2009
President Barack H. Obama
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
Washington, DC 20500
Dear President Obama:
Since the administration of Woodrow Wilson, presidents have sent annually a wreath to the Arlington Confederate Monument. Prior to the administration of George H. W. Bush, this was done on or near the birthday of Jefferson Davis. Starting with George H.W. Bush, it has been done on Memorial Day.
We ask you to not send a wreath or some other commemorative token to the Arlington Confederate Monument during your administration or after.
There are several reasons as to why this monument, a product of the Nadir in American race relations, should not be honored, and we list and explain them in this letter.
The monument was intended to legitimize secession and the principles of the Confederacy and glorify the Confederacy. It isn’t just a remembrance of the dead. The speeches at its ground-breaking and dedication defended and held up as glorious the Confederacy and the ideas behind it and stated that the monument was to these ideals as well as the dead. It was also intended as a symbol of white nationalism, portrayed in opposition to the multiracial democracy of Reconstruction, and a celebration of the re-establishment of white supremacy in the former slave states by former Confederate soldiers. In its design it also tells wrong history, boasting fourteen shields with the coat of arms of fourteen states. Thus it claims that Missouri, Kentucky, and Maryland were part of the Confederacy. They weren’t.
The monument was given to the Federal Government by the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC), which raised the funds to erect it. The UDC’s reasons for the monument are instructive. In the address of Mrs. Daisy McLaurin Stevens, President General of the United Daughters of the Confederacy at its dedication, she makes clear that the monument is to glorify the ideas of the Confederacy:
Great ideas and righteous ideas are alone immortal. The eternal years of God are theirs. The ideas our heroes cherished were and are beneficial as they are everlasting. These were living then; they are living to-day and shall live to-morrow and work the betterment of mankind. Thus our heroes are of those who, though dead, still toil for man through the arms and brains of those their examples have inspired and quickened to nobler things.
Since the United Daughters of the Confederacy upheld in multiple publications in the early 20th Century that the Ku Klux Klan was the heroic effort of the Confederate soldier, we have an idea what the “noble past” and “ideas our heroes cherished” were. Of course one of these “ideas” was secession to preserve the institution of African slavery.
Likewise General Bennett H. Young, Commander-in-Chief of the United Confederate Veterans also defends the cause of the Confederate soldier, the neo-Confederate cause of their descendants, and defends secession in his speech as follows:
At this hour I represent the survivors of the Southern army. Though this Confederate monument is erected on Federal ground, which makes it unusual and remarkable, yet the men from whom I hold commission would only have me come without apologies or regrets from the past. Those for whom I speak gave the best they had to their land and country. They spared no sacrifice and no privation to win for the Southland national independence.
I am sure I shall not offend the proprieties of either the hour of the occasion when I say that we still glory in the records of our beloved and immortal dead. The dead for whom this monument stands sponsor died for what they believed to be right. Their surviving comrades and their children still believe that that for which they suffered and laid down their lives was just; that their premises in the Civil War were according to our Constitution….
The sword said the South was wrong, but the sword is not necessarily guided by conscience or reason. The power of numbers and the longest guns cannot destroy principle nor obliterate truth. Right lives forever, it survives battles, failures, conflicts, and death. There is no human power, however mighty, that can in the end annihilate truth.
In fact, most white Southerners in 1914 agreed that both slavery and secession were wrong. Not Young. No apologies. No regrets -- despite the historical record of Confederate soldiers having committed racial atrocities of massacring surrendered African American soldiers on at least eight occasions.
Hilary A. Herbert, Chairman of the Executive Committee of the Arlington Confederate Monument Association, makes it clear that the monument stands for the legitimacy of secession, in opposition to Reconstruction, and for white supremacy. In his History of The Arlington Confederate Monument at Arlington, Virginia, he writes:
In 1867 the seceding States were subjected to the horrors of Congressional Reconstruction, but in a few years American manhood had triumphed; Anglo-Saxon civilization had been saved; local self-government under the Constitution had been restored; ex-Confederates were serving the National Government, and true patriots, North and South, were addressing themselves to the noble task of restoring fraternal feeling between the sections.
Within a generation after Congressional Reconstruction, American historians condemned it …. as “a crime against civilization,” and public opinion seems to have approved the verdict.
Herbert goes on to refer to the Confederate soldiers who joined the Ku Klux Klan and Red Shirts as being heroes for restoring white supremacy and overthrowing Reconstruction, referring to “the soldiers who fought the battles of the Confederacy and … by their courage and devotion during the two decades after the war, were saviors of Anglo-Saxon civilization in their section.”
The monument itself has a Latin motto, “Victrix causea Diis placuit, sed victa Catoni.” It translates, “The winning cause pleased the Gods, but the losing cause pleased Cato.” This is a classical reference which to the cognoscenti implies that Lincoln was a despot and the Union cause unjust; Cato, the stoic believer in “freedom,” would have sided with the Confederacy.
The Arlington Confederate Monument is a denial of the wrong committed against African Americans by slave owners, Confederates, and neo-Confederates, through the monument’s denial of slavery as the cause of secession and its holding up of Confederates as heroes. This implies that the humanity of Africans and African Americans is of no significance.
Today, the monument gives encouragement to the modern neo-Confederate movement and provides a rallying point for them. The modern neo-Confederate movement interprets it as vindicating the Confederacy and the principles and ideas of the Confederacy and their neo-Confederate ideas. The presidential wreath enhances the prestige of these neo-Confederate events.
Fr. Alister C. Anderson, as Chaplain-in-Chief of the Sons of Confederate Veterans (SCV), at the 85th anniversary of the dedication of the Arlington Confederate Monument in 1999, gave a lengthy speech explaining its meaning. His understanding of the Arlington Confederate Monument can be said to be fairly representative of modern neo-Confederate opinion.
Anderson believes that the Civil War was a holy war between an orthodox Christian nation (the South), a view widespread in the neo-Confederate movement, and what he feels was an un-Christian and heretical North, as he explained in a series of articles in the Confederate Veteran as Chaplain-in-Chief of the SCV. This explains some of the passages of his speech at the Arlington Confederate Monument. In his speech Anderson explains regarding the monument:
… It reveals and concentrates in beautiful, rugged bronze nearly every idea that a true Southern historian, theologian, statesman, and patriotic citizen could present about the religion, culture, morals, economics, and politics of a civilization from out of which the Confederate States of America evolved. The monument captures the ideals and accomplishments that still existed at the end of the War for Southern Independence. Thank God it does not depict the beginning of the Reconstruction Era, the most disgusting and destructive period in United States history from which the South has never really recovered.
Anderson goes on to note Washington’s presence in bronze:
It depicts George Washington on horseback with the Latin inscription DEO VINDICE, which means, “God Vindicates.” Southerners believed under the Constitution they had the right to secede if they were being harmed by a tyrannical government.
To Anderson, as to other neo-Confederates today, the Arlington Monument exists to glorify the ideas of the Confederacy, which he sees as the ideas of the neo-Confederacy.
Anderson goes on to explain, correctly, the meaning of the main inscription on the monument, “Victrix causea Diis placuit, sed victa Catoni.” This is a line from a poem Pharasalia by the Roman poet Lucan, used to represent Lincoln as a tyrant and the North as tyrannical. Fr. Anderson explains:
Victix causa, “the winning cause (or side)”, referring to Julius Caesar’s inordinate ambition and his lust for total power and control, is compared with President Lincoln and the Federal Government’s desire and power to crush and destroy the South. Next we read diis placuit which translates “pleased the gods.” In this context, gods are with a small “g” and refer to the gods of mythology; the gods of money, power, war and domination, greed, hate, lust and ambition. Next we come to the noble climax of this quotation, sed victa cantoni which translates “but the losing side (or cause) pleased Cato”. Here Lucan, the poet, refers to Pompey’s fight to retain the old conservative, traditional republican government of Rome. Even though Pompey was defeated by Caesar’s greater military power, his defeat, nevertheless, pleased the noble Cato. And here, of course, Cato represents the noble aims of the Southern Confederacy. The South fought politically to maintain the Constitution which had guided her safely for eighty-seven years. She merely wanted to be left alone and governed by it. The aggression-minded totalitarian Northern government would not permit that and so she pleased the gods of abolitionism, transcendentalism, utopianism, state centralism, universalism, rationalism and a host of other “isms.”
Anderson here denounces abolition, the anti-slavery movement that ultimately led the United States of America out of the moral evil of slavery, as an evil itself.
Sending a wreath to the Arlington Confederate Memorial Monument enhances the prestige of the United Daughters of the Confederacy, an organization with a long history of racism from praising the Ku Klux Klan in the early part of the 20th century, to publishing articles against the Civil Rights movement in the Civil Rights Era, to promoting neo-Confederacy today. When the president of the United States of America enhances the prestige of this monument and of the United Daughters of the Confederacy, he strengthens a group working to set back America’s progress in race relations.
Finally, in 2009, the main speaker for the annual observance at the Arlington Confederate Memorial is Ron Maxwell, director of the movie “Gods and Generals,” whose neo-Confederate meaning he made clear in an interview in Southern Partisan. He also has written expressing his fear of Hispanic immigration leading to civil war in the notoriously racist Chronicles magazine, the organ of the ultra-right Rockford Foundation.
For the president of the United States of America to send a wreath to the monument this year would contribute to providing Ron Maxwell with a more prestigious setting for his speech. It would aid and abet the ongoing use of presidential prestige and this monument for their neo-Confederate agenda.
We ask you to break this chain of racism stretching back to Woodrow Wilson, and not send a wreath or other token of esteem to the Arlington Confederate Monument. This monument should not be elevated in prestige above other monuments by a presidential wreath.
Sincerely yours,
Last Name First Name Institution Biographical Information (for identification purposes only)
Alexander Shawn Leigh Langston Hughes Center, Kansas University Assistant Professor African and African American Studies, Interim Director, Langston Hughes Center
Attie Jeanie Long Island University Associate Professor of History
Ayers Bill University of Illinois, Chicago Professor of Education
Barber David University of Tennessee, Martin Assistant Professor of History
Blakely Allison Boston University Professor of European and Comparative History; George and Joyce Wein Professor of African American Studies.
Bridges Roger D. Rutherford .B. Hayes Presidential Center Executive Director Emeritus
Brown Joshua The City University of New York Executive Director American Social History Project/ Center for Media and Learning, Professor of History, Ph.D. Program in History, The Graduate Center.
Burton Orville Vernon Coastal Carolina University Burroughs Distinguished Professor of Southern History and Culture at Coastal Carolina University. Formerly he was Director of the Institute for Computing in the Humanities, Arts, and Social Sciences (ICHASS) at the University of Illinois, where he is Professor of History, African American Studies, and Sociology. He is also a Senior Research Scientist at the National Center for Supercomputing Applications (NCSA), where he is Associate Director of Humanities and Social Sciences. In addition, he is Executive Director of the College of Charleston’s Program in the Carolina Lowcountry and Atlantic World.
Christie Thomas Lincoln Public Schools, Lincoln, Nebraska Multicultural Administrator
Davis Simone Mt. Holyoke College Professor of English
Ewert George Former Director of the Museum of Mobile
Farley Jonathan Institute fur Algebra Johannes Kepler Universitat Linz Teaching and Research Fellow
Fellman Gordon Brandeis University Professor of Sociology
Fink Leon University of Illinois, Chicago Distinguished Professor. Director of WRGUW (Graduate Concentration in the History of Work, Race, and Gender in the Urban World)
Department of History
Finkelman Paul Albany Law School President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
Gundaker Grey College of William & Mary Professor of Anthropology
Hague Euan DePaul University, Chicago Professor of Cultural Geography, editor of "Neo-Confederacy: A Critical Introduction."
Hayes-Bautista David E School of Medicine, UCLA Author of numerous articles on Calfornia Hispanic history
Hicks David Virginia Tech Associate Professor of History and Social Science Education
Jackson Kenneth T. Columbia University, NYC Professor of History and Social Sciences
Jennings Matt H. Macon State College Student
Katznelson Ira Columbia University, NYC Ruggles Professor of Political Science and History
Kennedy Roger G. National Museum of American History (ret.), National Park Service (ret.) Director Emeritus, National Museum of American History, Former Director, National Park Service
Key Barclay Western Illinois University Assistant Professor of African-American History
Key DeWayne Mars Hill Bible School, Florence, Alabama
Knapp Peter Villanova University Professor of Sociology
Leib Jonathan Old Dominion University Associate Professor of Geography
Loewen James Univ. of Vermont Professor Emeritus of Sociology, Univ. of Vermont; author of "Lies My Teacher Told Me," "Lies Across America," "Sundown Towns," etc.
Love David, A. Commentator Columnist at www.blackcommentator.com
McPherson James Princeton University Professor of History
Miller Willaim Lee Univ. of Virginia
Mitchell Don Syracuse University Professor of Geography
Mizell Linda University of Colorado at Boulder Assistant Professor, School of Education
Murray Paul Siena College Professor of Sociology
Nieto Sonia University of Massachusetts at Amherst Professor Emerita, Language, Literary, and Culture
Owens Deirdre Cooper University of Mississippi Assistant Professor of History
Parenti Michael On advisory boards of Independent Progressive Politics Network, Education Without Borders, the Jasenovic Foundation, New Political Science, and Nature, Society and Thought. Author of many books in political science.
Phillips Michael Collin College, Plano, Texas History Professor, Author of "White Metropolis"
Roisman Florence W. Indiana University School of Law William F. Harvey Professor of Law
Schmeeckle Maria Illinois State University Associate Professor of Sociology
Sebesta Edward H. Independent researcher. Editor of "Neo-Confederacy: A Critical Introduction," University of Texas Press.
Shabazz Amilcar University of Massachusetts at Amherst Professor and Chair of the W.E.B. DuBois Department of Afro-American Studies
Sinha Manisha University of Massachusetts at Amherst Associate Professor of Afro-American Studies and History
Sleeter Christine California State University Monterey Bay Professor Emerita, College of Professional Studies
Sowa Maureen Bristol Community College Professor of History
Webster Gerald Raymond University of Wyoming Chair, Department of Geography
White George, Jr. York College, CUNY Assistant Professor of History
Wiener Jon University of California, Irvine; The Nation Magazine Contributing Editor at "The Nation"; Professor of History at UC-Irvine.
*******************************************************************************
Note I posted, at the top, link to George Mason University's History News Network.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Wed May 20 2009, 07:30PM
Frankly, I agree wholeheartedly with the signatories and, in fact, I hope that they also do not honor your noble dead.
The dishonorable, corrupt, malignant, tyrannous and wicked cannot “honor” anything – and this whole group starting with the Fraud-in-Chief and including the signatory “scholars” – are incapable of bestowing honor or grace or decency or any other noble attribute. Frankly, I would sooner that a decent drunk urinated on my grave than that any one of these creatures paid it homage.
In fact, if I were the SCV and the UDC and the LoS, I’d have a cordon of good Southrons surrounding the monument to make absolutely sure that no politician of any stripe, pseudo-historian or academician went anywhere near it! Remember, it is as praiseworthy to be despised by the despicable as it is to be admired by the admirable. I hope your noble dead are spared the attentions of the present government and creatures like those who signed this "letter". Let them go honor Lincoln, a man who deserves the praise of the hypocrites, grafters and murderers.
Further, I call for a groundswell of letters by Southerners - and especially those in leadership roles in the movement - to newspapers, magazines, television and radio stations, internet blogs et al. demanding that this request be honored to the point at which no individual who has any connection ideologically, politically or morally with the current illegal occupant of the White House is permitted within 100 feet of any Confederate monument or the graves of its noble dead! Bet that would get a whole lot of notice in the media!
Ask yourself, gentlemen and ladies, would Lee or Jackson or Stuart or my Mosby be happy to see old Obammy comin' up the hill with his coterie of hangers-on to get his "photo-op" at their graves? I think we all know the answer to that question!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Wed May 20 2009, 11:22PM
Val,
Write (edit) the above into a letter and I will get some signatures on it ASAP. It is too late to send to Obama, but I think we still have time to get our point across. The only restriction I know about SHAPE and politics is that we are not supposed to try to Federal influence legislation AFTER we are granted our 501C status.
Once it is done I am going to send a copy to Owens Deirdre Cooper University of Mississippi Assistant Professor of History.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gator, Thu May 21 2009, 02:10AM
can i get a copy of the letter so that i can pass it to some louisiana officals
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 03:13AM
I am thinking that we can just use the edit button and add our names to the letter. If you get time try it with this post. I am an admin so I know I can do it. Not sure about nonmembers. I am gonna sign off and give it a try as a non member,
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 03:16AM
A non member cannot add his name to the list they can only use the quote feature.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Thu May 21 2009, 02:43PM
Here is a draft of a possible letter. If it is not suitable, let me know where the problems lie and I'll try to "tweak it up".
-----------------------------------
The “scholars” who have petitioned President Obama to ignore the Confederate monument in Arlington on Memorial day are absolutely correct. Indeed, it is to be devoutly hoped that Obama, representatives of the present “government” and the likes of these bastions of failed academia avoid all contact with and desecration of the monuments and graves of the noble Confederate dead together with any hypocritical acts of pretended homage.
The dishonorable, corrupt, tyrannous and wicked cannot “honor” anything; it is a contradiction in terms. This whole cabal - beginning with a man whose constitutional legitimacy to hold the office of President is highly questionable and including the signatory “scholars” - are incapable of bestowing any noble attribute, much less one worthy of the men honored by this monument.
Indeed, those organizations and individuals who value and honor Southern history and heritage should provide a cordon of good Southrons around the monument to make absolutely sure that no politician of any stripe, no pseudo-historian or self-acclaimed academician goes anywhere near it! Remember, it is as praiseworthy to be despised by the despicable as it is to be admired by the admirable. Let us hope that the South’s noble dead are spared the attentions of the present government and the "signatory scholars". Let them go and honor Lincoln, an earlier corrupt product of the infamous Illinois political machine and a man who deserves the praise of hypocrites, grafters and murderers.
We must ask if Robert E. Lee would rejoice at the current occupant of the White House with his coterie of knaves and sycophants using his grave for crass propaganda? All those who fought and died during the War of Secession spilled their blood to oppose the tyrants in Washington. Will we beg the current tyrant to use Confederate heroes as a tawdry “photo-op” in hopes that he will bestow upon us the lesser descendants of greater ancestors, legitimacy and relevance in the coming New World Order? God forbid!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 04:06PM
I like it!!! Gonna ask Pat for some assistance on this.
Note I added the SHAPE logo to it.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Thu May 21 2009, 05:46PM
I am glad it is to your liking. But please do not feel it necessary to give any mention of myself in its formation. I did it for you as Southerners. I certainly do not mind being associated with it as I have already posted similar statements on the web, but my involvement might tend to "muddy the waters" if it is seen to be a "Yankee" effort to put words in the mouths of Southrons.
Of course, when you send it to various persons or groups, you can certainly mention its origins since I am very much against folks who haven't the courage to sign their names to their opinions, but I have no desire for acclaim public or otherwise though I do not fear criticism or worse - getting used to it, you know!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 07:15PM
Yankee or not I tend to agree Obama has not earned the right to have anything to do with honoring my ancestors. He is against everything they fought for. Also you are a member of SHAPE in good standing and that is good enough with us.
We are working on getting it posted as a petition, although it will not be a petition in a true sense it will just be a letter which people sign, I intend to print it up and send to some of those biased, liberal scholars.
It will be good to feed them some of their own medicine.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 21 2009, 08:20PM
George we do not have our Federal 501(c) status yet do we? if not then let's push this to the max. I think the letter is good to go. I just sent it to my 2 Senators and Congressman with my own letter attached( highlighting Bill Ayers endorsement) They are most likely unaware of this, and honestly I cannot find anything out there that would suggest this letter was received/acknowledged/endorsed by the President and his office plans to NOT go through with the wreath laying ceremony. Anybody out there got any other news on this?
gpthelastrebel wrote ...
Val,
Write (edit) the above into a letter and I will get some signatures on it ASAP. It is too late to send to Obama, but I think we still have time to get our point across. The only restriction I know about SHAPE and politics is that we are not supposed to try to Federal influence legislation AFTER we are granted our 501C status.
Once it is done I am going to send a copy to Owens Deirdre Cooper University of Mississippi Assistant Professor of History.
GP
Val,
Write (edit) the above into a letter and I will get some signatures on it ASAP. It is too late to send to Obama, but I think we still have time to get our point across. The only restriction I know about SHAPE and politics is that we are not supposed to try to Federal influence legislation AFTER we are granted our 501C status.
Once it is done I am going to send a copy to Owens Deirdre Cooper University of Mississippi Assistant Professor of History.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 09:45PM
Not at this time and our only restriction as a 501 group is that we not try to influnece legislation. If we could find the email address for the site Obama put up----
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 09:54PM
Mark, Val, should we add Sir or Madam or another greeting to the top ? How about we we the undersigned ---
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 21 2009, 10:31PM
Both in my opinion, also need a lead in/ preface or something, like: After reading the letter sent to Mr. Obama by this so called esteemed group of intellects and historians including the self admitted terrorist Bill Ayers we offer this as our response........
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Thu May 21 2009, 11:19PM
heck ya'll get the finer details fixed and i'll get to work tomorrow. Pat can post as soon as he gets the OK.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 22 2009, 12:36AM
I love the idea of an outright REJECTION of the whole rotten crew. They believe that we'll be crying in our beer at being spurned by such important people. Dolts! Who cares what they think (IF they think, most of them!) In fact, if any one of them had something good to say about me, I'd dress in sackcloth and throw ashes on my head for whatever terrible sin I committed that gained their approval!
It's time we stopped trying to be loved. I really do "dig" that saying about being despised by the despicable... it fits the bill here right enough.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Patrick, Fri May 22 2009, 04:01AM
Here is the petition on the SHAPE website that people can sign. Please let me know if I need to change anything.
SHAPE Petition
You can also get to the petition from the main menu. It is the last item on the main menu.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Fri May 22 2009, 04:55AM
Thanks Pat can you note somewhere or perhaps even paste on the petition the letter Mr. J. W. Booth posted. That way everyone will know what they are signing.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 22 2009, 01:14PM
Signed and left comment (naturally). I'll post its site where I can.
Have contacted a lot of folks and asked them to contact others. I know that some have signed on already. Hopefully, the thing will "mushroom" as it becomes known, but we have to "beat the drums" for it until it gathers its own momentum.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Fri May 22 2009, 05:20PM
Just sent out a mass mail to all my contacts, in addition to emailing all SHAPE Members from our GMAIL.. Thank you Lady Val for all your efforts!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 22 2009, 07:54PM
You're entirely welcome. Only wish I could do more.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Mon May 25 2009, 12:24AM
To fully understand just "who" Ed Sebesta is & what he is, please click on........
http://web.archive.org/web/20021222000259/www.orderofwhitetrash.com/cfish/index2.htm
We tread on very thin-ice when we declare that we "agree" with ANYTHING that this homosexual hater of everything Southron writes. At last check, Ed is still living with his black gay lover.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Mon May 25 2009, 12:55AM
Mr. Booth,
Thanks for the link it will come in handy later.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 28 2009, 05:07PM
That was me btw, I was having fits trying to sign in, gave up and went with Anonymous...LOL
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Thu May 28 2009, 05:13PM
Mr Booth, I just read over some of the info on the link you provided, I agree this man is slime squared!
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Thu May 28 2009, 09:37PM
8milereb,
to be polite here let me just say that I have been fighting the "crawfish" for over 14 years, over Southern Heritage issues. He works very closely with Kyle Vanlandingham (who is also gay) & Morris Dees, Mark Potok & Heidi Berich of the SPLC.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 29 2009, 10:58AM
I will make no comment upon this as I have no right to do so. I will leave it up to those who do have a right to respond.
Wreaths win Obama praise from Sons of Confederate Veterans
Gestures honor black Union soldiers as well as Confederate war dead
By WAYNE WASHINGTON - wwashington©thestate.com
President Barack Obama, the nation’s first black chief executive, will be getting a thank you note from the Sons of Confederate Veterans for continuing a tradition of honoring the Confederate dead on Memorial Day.
A group of 48 historians, including one from Coastal Carolina University, had asked Obama not to send a wreath to an Arlington National Cemetery monument honoring Confederate dead — a practice started in 1914 by Woodrow Wilson, who was born in Virginia and lived in Columbia as a young man.
Obama sent the wreath to the Confederate monument, but he also sent one to a Washington, D.C., cemetery that honors black Union soldiers.
The president’s actions pleased Chuck McMichael, commander in chief of the Sons of Confederate Veterans.
“The president did very well by sending a wreath to honor American veterans of all types,” McMichael said. “He upheld the tradition of the office to which he was elected. I do intend to send him a thank you letter. This is the kind of thing that transcends politics.”
Orville Vernon Burton, who teaches Southern culture and history at Coastal Carolina, was among the 48 historians who signed the letter asking Obama not to send a wreath to the Confederate monument.
Burton said there is not enough appreciation for the many Southerners — black and white — who fought to keep the Union together.
On Memorial Day, presidents typically lay a wreath at Arlington’s Tomb of the Unknowns, a monument to U.S. service members who have died without being identified.
Presidents also have directed that a wreath be sent to the Confederate monument.
Burton said he was concerned that Obama would be “singling out a group that wanted to split the Union” unless he also sent a wreath to a Union monument.
“People don’t know how close we came to not having a Union, and what that would mean for freedom today,” he said.
Burton said he learned about the historians’ letter through one of its two authors, James Loewen. A sociologist, author and professor, Loewen also has argued the statue of former S.C. politician “Pitchfork” Ben Tillman on the State House grounds should be toppled because of Tillman’s career-long support of white supremacy and violent black disenfranchisement.
Officials at the White House did not respond Tuesday or Wednesday to questions about Obama’s decision to send a wreath to the Confederate monument.
McMichael of the Sons of Confederate Veterans said he was glad the president did not address the letter. “I thought the letter was absurd and should not have been taken seriously.”
Burton said he does not know of any official response to the historians’ letter, which detailed the Confederate monument’s history, its Latin inscriptions and the words of those who have spoken in its shadow.
“The monument was intended to legitimize secession and the principles of the Confederacy,” the letter states. “It isn’t just a remembrance of the dead.”
In not responding to the letter, Obama steered clear of the passions that still exist regarding slavery and the Civil War.
Alexander Stephens, vice president of the Confederate States of America, said in 1861 that “African slavery” was “the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution,” a verdict many present-day historians accept.
But the Web site for the Sons of Confederate Veterans, which describes itself as “the oldest hereditary organization for male descendants of Confederate soldiers,” says the “citizen-soldiers who fought for the Confederacy personified the best qualities of America. The preservation of liberty and freedom was the motivating factor in the South’s decision to fight the Second American Revolution.”
Burton said Obama’s decision also to send a wreath to a cemetery honoring black Union soldiers was “extremely diplomatic.”
Not sending a wreath to the Confederate monument “would have been harder for him because he’s African-American,” said Burton, adding Obama would have encountered a backlash from some white Americans.
In the end, Burton said, he can accept Obama’s decision to send a wreath to both Union and Confederate monuments.
“It does represent the reconciliation of North and South,” he said.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 29 2009, 11:13AM
RE the Sebasta material: one of the documents listed no longer seems to be available. Sebasta is only a symptom of a much larger problem and the fact that his particular "hobby horse" has garnered the approval of men who are considered "historians" like McPherson clearly shows that these decisions are being made on matters not concerned with history but with ideology. Well, if that is the case (and it is), we'd better be prepared to defend not only your history, but our ideology or the facts simply won't matter at all.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Fri May 29 2009, 12:08PM
I notice he placed a wreath for the USCT. I find it a bit amusing that they were segregated in the WBTS and are still segregated today. I think it is great we have a Confederate Monument to honor all races that fought for the Confederacy.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Fri May 29 2009, 03:13PM
I have often wondered if the Union chose to raise USCT's as a means to end the war, or THEM!..they were often used as cannon fodder
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Fri May 29 2009, 03:28PM
I'll admit I haven't researched this a lot, but from what I have read, the USCT mostly freed more whites to die. I did some research sometime back and the best figures I could find was a high of 3,500 USCT dieing in battle.
GP
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Fri May 29 2009, 06:07PM
Good point George, just look at the Battle of the crater. With the tunnel approaching success, preparation began above ground for a possible assault. Burnside selected his largest and freshest division, his Fourth Division for the attack. His other three divisions had been in combat since the Wilderness, and were in no fit state to launch another attack. The only problem was that this division contained mostly black troops. In something of a catch-twenty two situation, the Fourth Division had been denied combat because it had no combat experience. Now they were to get their great chance. They were as keen as any unit in the Union army, determined to prove their fighting ability.
Right at the last minute they were denied that chance. Despite eleven days of intense training, on 29 July General Meade decided to withdraw them from the operation. There appears to have been a combination of reasons for this. First was the concern about using an inexperienced division, especially on such a complex operation. Second was a general worry about the consequences of using a black division in such an attack. If things went wrong, Grant and Meade could have been accused of using their black soldiers in an unjustifiably risky attack. The Fourth Division had been trained to take advantage, advancing rapidly, avoiding entering the crater itself, securing the flanks of the breach in the lines and hopefully preventing the Confederates from forming a new line further back. Ledlie’s men knew none of this. They advanced slowly towards the scene of devastation. Many went straight down into the crater, instead of splitting left and right around it.
All of this gave the Confederate artillery time to target the crater, slowing down the Union advance even more. Meanwhile, Confederate troops who had fled the area, fearing a second explosion, began to return. A counterattack, organised by William Mahone, soon forced the confused Union attacks back out of the crater, with heavy losses. The Fourth Division managed to get into the battle just in time to take many of these losses.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
, Fri May 29 2009, 06:47PM
On July 30, Union military engineers exploded a vast amount of dynamite in a shaft that had been dug under Confederate lines. Five regiments of Colored Troops had been assigned the task of spearheading the resultant Union attack into the gaping hole in the Rebel lines. The 28th USCT was one of the regiments selected. The black troops from the divisions of Generals Ledlie and Ferrero stormed into the massive crater caused by the explosion amid a maze of broken bodies and bloody rivulets. While the black troops gathered in awe at the base of the crater, their generals remained behind, drinking liquor in a dug out bomb proof hut. Without effective leadership, the impetus and surprise of the attack died out and gave Rebel forces under General William Mahone time to counterattack. The Rebel counter stroke was brutal in force and ferocity. Black soldiers in the crater tried to surrender, but Mahone’s men refused the surrender and shot down and bayoneted the leaderless Union troops. The attack that had been so promising now devolved into a foot race back to the safety of the Union siege lines. Behind them, the 28th USCT left nearly half of their brothers dead or wounded, including seven of eleven officers.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Fri May 29 2009, 06:48PM
It wasn't Meade, it was Grant. Burnside did his homework and had a great plan in motion but Grant wouldn't permit the black troops to lead. One Yankee who presented it said he was afraid of negative publicity if the death toll was too high (try making that point about the black troops wiped out attacking Fort Wagner). Another more cynical fellow said that Grant didn't want the blacks to get the credit of the victory and so Burnside had no choice but to send in white troops who had not been prepared. They marched into instead of around the pit and were shot like ducks in a barrel. By the time the black troops were allowed to assist, Mahone had arrived with his cavalry and the end result was not pretty.
One fellow Confederate reported that a lot of the casualties suffered by the black troops resulted from cries as they attacked that they were fighting "under the black flag" and would kill every white including civilians. Now I've heard that before, but whether it is an accurate report or simply something that is an "urban legend", I don't know.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Sat May 30 2009, 04:34AM
Regardless of the losses at the crater or anyplace else, the total number lost is battle wouldn't scratch the surface of what the white troops for either side lost. That is the point I am making in reference to the 8 massacres mentioned in the letter. I just do not see it. Hopefully by the end of next week I will get started on some letter writing.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
Lady Val, Sat May 30 2009, 10:50AM
Well, one thing that I have heard and is supposedly well substantiated. Black Confederate prisoners of war were often shot when they reached the prison camps to which they were sent. Hardly an "enlightened" act on the part of the noble Union.
Also, with regard to Union "buffalo soldiers" as the Indians called them, well when they died at the hands of Confederates it is presented as if they were singled out rather than just being another casualty of war. Black federals however, were often used to guard Confederate prisoners and took an especial delight in tormenting them, especially the officers. One former slave found himself guarding his former master and took delight in tormenting him by shouting "Top rung on de bottom now, Massa! Top rung on de bottom!" It is not unusual therefore, that the reaction of many Southern soldiers towards black Yankees was more than ordinarily hostile.
Still, I am reminded of what an Indian chief told members of Congress when he testified about the war in the west: "When the white man wins, it is a victory. When the Indian wins, it is a massacre." The same can be said for black Union casualties.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Sat May 30 2009, 02:57PM
"Black Confederate prisoners of war were often shot when they reached the prison camps to which they were sent."
I have also heard that. I would love to have some instances of this with solid sources.
GP
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Sat May 30 2009, 03:25PM
During the day the platform around the pen is constantly paced by sentinels chiefly of the Invalid Corps, whose duty it is to see that the prisoners are orderly, and particularly, that no one crosses “the dead line.” This is a shallow ditch traced around within the enclosure, about fifteen feet from the fence. The penalty for stepping over this is death and although the sentinels are probably instructed to warn any one who may be violating the rule, the order does not seem to be imperative, and the negroes, when on duty, rarely troubled themselves with this superfluous formality.
Last night the negro regiment which constitutes part of our guard and which had been raiding over in Westmoreland and the adjacent counties returned. Their captives consisted of a hundred head of cattle-principally poor women’s cows-several ploughs, buggies, primeval sulkies, harrows, beds, chairs, etc and who knows what else they may do and all from twenty to thirty decrepit CITIZENS. Every month and sometimes more frequently, they are sent across the river by their officers on a plundering tour. These raids, usually made in a country entirely devoid of Confederates soldiers, are not reported by the yankees but are used to keep alive the martial ardor and fidelity of the black troops.
...Sgt. Anthony M. Keiley, POW, Pt. Lookout
Sorry I know I got off topic, but as you can see in this letter there were bad things going on that many folks have never heard of.
Over 180,000 African Americans fought in this war, on both sides of the battle. The total number of African American soldiers who died during the Civil War was around 40,000.
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
8milereb, Sat May 30 2009, 03:43PM
Letter of Private Frank Bailey, 34th New York Infantry Regiment USA to his brother in Middleville, New York: -
"West Point, Virginia, 12 May 1862 - I hear that the Rebels sent out a Regt. of niggers to fight our men and that they were as naked as when they were born, except the brogues on their feet, and they incited to all sorts of cruelty. It is said that they cut the throats of our wounded and then rob them of every article of any value. The soldiers are death on niggers now. If they catch a [censored] in the woods, and there is no officer near, they hang them without any ceremony. Now if this is true that the Southern chivalry as they style themselves put these niggers up to such deeds as this, may the curse of good light on them. It is worse than the English were in the Revolution to hire the Indians, but their race is about run when the stoop to such barbarism as that. Yesterday there was two niggers hung close by here by our men. One of them had $20.00 government note in his pocket. There is no mistake but the Rebels have black soldiers for I have seen them brought in as prisoners of war. I hear most are killed even before they reach the prison which serves them right.I saw one who had the stripes of an orderly sergeant on his coat. I don't beleive in taking them prisoner, but kill them where ever they find them, that they may never more curse the land with their hateful presence."
Re: Arlington Confederate Monument & Obama
gpthelastrebel, Sat May 30 2009, 05:06PM
That it. Great job!!!!!!
GP